PS2 Current 1 GB\GiB size?

Discussion in 'General PS2 Discussion' started by jolek, Aug 24, 2019.

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    jolek

    jolek Senior Member

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    I wanted to know what size game actually have, so I've checked it's property.

    E.g. Legacy of Kain: Soul Reaver 2 (DVD5) shows 4.6 GB in linux.
    4.31 GB at Windows.
     
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2019
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    TnA

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    A DVD5 is 4.38GB in size, not 4.6GB (you probably refer to max. 4.7GiB =/= GB)!

    Btw.: There is also the shrinker-tool!

    One example is EyeToy Play, which is over 4GB in size and all files are pretty much exactly 700MB only. It works from a CD, lol...
     
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    jolek

    jolek Senior Member

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    I was using size that my OS is showing.
    In Linux Mint 19.2:
    [​IMG]
    In Windows XP SP3:
    [​IMG]

    Size and more info can be found at redump:
    http://redump.org/disc/7245/.
     
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    TnA

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    As you can see for yourself, Mint doesn't show the proper GB... Real GB are calculated with factors of 1024 instead of 1000...

    These 'improper GB' have their own name and abbreviation/shortening, like I stated before! They are NOT 'GB'!
     
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    jolek Senior Member

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    Yea, there is something strange in it.

    There are two GB "system's".
    • Base 10 (decimal)
      1 GB = 1000000000 bytes (= 10003 B = 109 B)

    • Base 2 (binary)
      1 GiB = 1073741824 bytes (= 10243 B = 230 B).
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gigabyte.

    So Linux is using GB from SI (decimal).
    While Windows binary.
     
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2019
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    TnA

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    Wow! What kind of Mandela-Effect is that?! Lol

    The 'standard-definition' of a GigaByte is now base 10, because 'Giga' is used in the name?

    That's outright Ludacris, because it neither makes sense from a logical nor from a language-point of view...
    1024 EVER was and still is the factor to multiply between the Byte-Units (Byte, KB, MB, GB, TB, PB, EB, etc.), so claiming 'base10' on technology which is rooted in binary and not base10, is quite non-sensical...

    It was only 'a standard' for Memory-Device manufacturers, to show 'how big' an HDD, a DVD, a Stick (and so on) SUPPOSEDLY is and since DECADES people ask the same question... Why is my DVD/HDD/Stick smaller than advertised...
    Mind you... On a CD they do still use proper MB!!!


    From a language-point of view it also does not make any sense, because a PREfix is like the name implies, an extension ahead of the BASE which the name also gives away... GigaBYTE! So it's base is Byte!!!

    ...or since it is based on math...
    8 * 8 * 8 * 2 =1024

    ...or 'logic' applied in electronics...
    Every Filesystem and their Data-Sections are based in Binary...
    2^8=256 possibilities
    2^10=1024 possibilities
    Data-sections in filesystem are based on 512Byte-Sectors and '4k'-sectors... Are 4K-Sectors 4000Byte? No... They are 4096Byte on the very same device, the Wikipedia-Author claims the calculations are being based on '10' and therefore (according to the author) the manufacturers stated the true and standard GB, instead of an 'improper GB'! That's false!

    That Wikipedia-Article is FACTUALLY WRONG (partially), because it inverses the fact, which is the standard-base!!! Almost everything else seems to be correct!
     
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2019
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    Tupakaveli

    Tupakaveli VIP PSX-Place Supporter

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    GiB = Gibibyte
    2 to the 30th power (1,073,741,824) bytes (base 2)

    GB = Gigabyte
    10 to the 9th power (1,000,000,000) bytes (base 10)
     
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    TnA

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    I know... I just wasn't sure if it were really standardized! We used that prefix in threads on psx-scene.com a decade ago, but apparently it was just really standardized and spread at that time!

    The reason is exactly what I was referring to in what I marked bold in my previous post!

    The storage-manufacturers referred to - back then - improper sizes!
    Floppy 1.44MB/1.38MiB
    HDD 10GB/9.31GiB
    DVD 4.7GB/4.38GiB
    CD actually had, what was written on it...

    ...but back in the days there was no 'bi'-frefix-bind, so there was ONLY byte-based multiplication referring to 'ga'-Bytes...


    The new 'bi' (exclusive binary based) prefix was introduced due to manufacturers 'blurring the name-meaning'!
    (Which I wrote in my previous post.)

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Binary_prefix
     
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2019
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    What I still claim to be factually wrong in the wiki-article are just 2 sentences, which claim the storage-manufacturers actually stated the 'correct' GB, while they actually intentionally 'blurred the line' for advertising...

    ...and that base10 is the standard, while actually base2 has been the standard for over 60 years and only because those manufacturers blurred the line, the 'need' for an 'exclusive binary prefix' was born in the first place!!!

    So the real standard still remains Gigabyte=1024^3*8 but for blurryness easyness, it is is also referred to via 1000^3*8...
    ...and for 'Anti-Blurryness' EXCLUSIVE prefixes were introduced... Kibibyte, Mebibyte, Gibibyte and so on where introduced... Essentially like 'Giga-Binary-Byte' and so on...

    Sorry, but here you can see 'rewriting history' in action!
     
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2019
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    jolek Senior Member

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    Berion

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    Actually Your Linux shows proper size as both state is GB. But... GiB is quite new nomenclature to once and for all split SI misleading from real data count. The problem is, no one use it... So everywhere You will see GB instead of GiB and this is also very handy for marketing man's.
     
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    TnA

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    Yes, it's one of the most common '(non-)issues' in the PC-World (especially for end-users)!

    Damn storage-manufacturers, lol... :

    Grande Finale. Heheheeeee. ^^


    Just another cause why 1024 is correct: Base2 and Base8 can merge on it...

    2^10 are 1024
    8^3 *2 are 1024
     
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    jolek

    jolek Senior Member

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    Theoretically we can also try to use Gigabyte (GB) and Gibibyte (GiB).
     
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    Berion

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    Indeed, 1024 is correct. ;] So personally, I switch to MiB, GiB, TiB long ago (in example in tutorials) to avoid misleading. And when someone again ask about it, I sending him to wiki where he can learn new useless in "normal life" terms. :D
     
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    I wished they had rather standardized a new name for these base10-Units...

    Old standards are usually not changed but extended via new sub-standards! WiFi/WLAN is a good example for this.

    'Gitebyte' for an Giga exclusive 10-based Byte, lol...
    Ki te byte
    Me te byte
    Gi te byte
    Te te byte
    Pe te byte
    Ex te byte

    Works as well, doesn't it? :D
     
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    sp193

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    I would rather use 1KB = 1024 bytes because the HDD sectors were traditionally 512 bytes in size. You can't divide 1000 by 512, to get an integer.
    This is also true in the case of memory, where the data bus width is typically a power of 2 bits.
     
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    TnA

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    That's exactly the reason why I claim the Wikipedia-Article to be partially wrong at least in regard to 2 sentences.


    I will quote these sentences which bug me, later.

    @Berion You probably understand, how I feel about it. lol :D
     
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    Berion

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    Well... ummm... no. :D I think SI vs Bi is enough to makes humans crazy.
     
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    TnA

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    I mean that you probably understand me in regards to one thing...

    "The manufacturers should not have used 'improper Gigabyte', in the first place."


    Edit: If they had used proper GB in the first place, there would not have been a need for a binary exclusive prefix to 'unblur the definition'.

    Essentially the same you just said...


    ...and Gigabyte has been used for 1024^3*8 (binary-based) for over 60 years...

    Who 'blurred the line'? Advertisers of storage-companies...!
     
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2019
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    jolek

    jolek Senior Member

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    The same insane thing is happening to USB.
    Previously we have, 1.0, 1.1, 2.0, boom!
    USB 3.1 Gen 1 (SuperSpeed), previously USB 3.0.
    USB 3.1 Gen 2 (SuperSpeed+).

    I don't know if this is true, but here is how version 3.2 will looks like:
    [​IMG]

    I mean you can wrote USB 3.2 in specification and it'll be true.
    Who will bother to use USB 3.2 Gen 2x2?
     
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