[Moved Comments] Piracy or not??

Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by Cypher_CG89, Mar 13, 2019.

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    pink1

    pink1 Moderator Developer

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    I know this is a silly thread but I'm really glad to get to the bottom of this so I don't make this mistake again.
     
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    RandomDude

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    https://www.muso.com/magazine/global-piracy-increases-throughout-2017-muso-reveals/

    Jump down the throat of all that people you call "thieves".
    Piracy isn't uncommon. Everyone with an internet connection pirates at least at one point in their lifetime. Knowingly or unknowingly.
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2019
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    GregoryRasputin

    GregoryRasputin PlayStationHAX PSX-Place Supporter

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    You don't mind pirating, but get annoyed by other people pirating?:D


    1.) One may not find anything about "VENOM" on the net, because they are a group of your imagination?
    2.) You complain about piracy, but at the same time were caught using something you have not paid for?
    There is a certain H word that comes to mind...

    Which games are those?
    Are they real games?
    Do they even exist?

    Very easy top get caught if you keep the files on your computer, in the same folder you downloaded it in, which has the name of the scene group that uploaded it to the net.

    People seem to twist what is and is not piracy to suit their own personal opinion, the fact is that downloading a game of the internet is piracy, regardless if you own one hundred copies of the game, you have downloaded the game so you have pirated it.
     
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    Desmo

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    Honestly, it's a personal decision to engage or not engage in piracy...one that could land you with some pretty big fines at least where I live. I was a a huge fan of the original Napster back in the day and used it on a daily basis. Of course, I was a young, entitled man back then and since it didn't effect me I didn't really care. With an extra almost 20yrs experience under my belt I now know that it does effect other people...namely the people who have toiled in that project to bring it to fruition.
    As I've gotten older I like to have physical copies with the manuals and other goodies that comes with official releases. With that being said, how do we view the classic retro consoles? Even if you engage in collecting official releases, the original creators are not getting a cut of that money. It's going all to a used reseller that has a brick and mortar store or an online presence. Is that piracy as well? Some people would argue yes but I disagree.
    Unfortunately, I think there is quite a bit of piracy going on in the JBing world of consoles and mobile phones. However, the rules here need to be respected and anyone coming around talking about downloading games should be warned to shut up and then booted if done again. It's about respecting the rules of someone else's home. If I'm told not to smoke inside I'm not going to fire up a cigarette the moment I sit down on the couch.
     
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    Cypher_CG89

    Cypher_CG89 Senior Member

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    The only thing I tried to explain was how this is written the argreed international copyright laws, I do not give a s**t what people do, I just explain the fact's as they are, and try to disscorage it when ever I can. People are free to do whatever they please to do.

    Thats you opinion.... not how its written in law.... you have purchased 1 single licenece for home use..... not the rights to what do you please with it, this is why an exemption is made under fair use for you to back your game up, to protect it. As you are not the creator or the copyright holder, only they can do as they please with it.

    If you don't take care of your disc's/media, why should the copyright holder pay for you to have a new one when its your own fault its damaged. If the the said product is damaged from brand new, say a production error, then you have the right to demand a replacement.

    In the case of hardware damage> again why should the copyright holder pay for something that is the responsiblilty of the device manufacturer> demand a new game of them> again this is why backing up your game is allowed under fair use.

    And this is where you have slightly tripped yourself up..... the place you are dowloading them from IS re-distributing them.... for you to download.... without permission or licence from the original copyright holder > which is " Copyright Infringment "/ " Piracy ". So therefore you are downloading Pirated content.

    And is found at the very top of this page: There in black and white for all to see........

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright_infringement

    Its quite easy to prove where they came from, well not for people like us anyways or me, I wouldn't know how to do it. There's what's called a digital fingerprint on everything. you delete something, it gets moved and recyled as empty space till it is overwirtten by something else.... And if you know how to do this then even that overwritten data can be recovered, not i fulll I dont think but enough to be able to determine if it from your computer or downloaded.... its called Digial forensics...

    How have I been caught when whatever YT vid is being mentioned is not mine, not my YT channel or anything like that of the sort.......

    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCjF1dHGJxkFad_qeAwStb7A/featured?view_as=subscriber

    Oh.... would you look at that.... thats my YT channel... and oh look as stated there is only one Vid on it... and nothing to do with piracy.... I do not have a YT channel for VENOM Elite Gaming, not VENOM or VENOM gaming...nor will I ever make one.... and just because groups can share the same or similar name does not mean they are the same.

    Seriouosly a group of my imgination??? @dazzaXx is the newest member..... so you can stick that comment where the sun don't shine mate.
    And everthing previous is private and will stay that way now after F**ktard comments like this from people that need to get their facts right about things they know nothing about but pressume to do so.....arrogance.

    And also the only way to 100% prove I did them would be to give my real name and for people to check the credits in the games..... like f**k am I giving me real name out. I take people at face value for this sort of thing and I hope there are other games devs in the scene. Also why the f**k should I risk revealing my idenetity to people... just because you say you want proof more or less.

    And also you may care to do what other's fail to do and that is to read whats been put form start to finish properly before commenting..... as you will clearly see me state that the YT vid is nothing to do with me... or are you impling that I am a liar .... I dont not take things like this lightly ...

    I have offered proof about YT but no... people will still think they are right all the time..... becuase they think they "Know it all" = arrogance.
     
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    dazzaXx

    dazzaXx Member

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    What's going on?
     
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    RandomDude

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    It's basically just this: (edited)
    Capture54.PNG
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2019
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    DeViL303

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    I have no idea what you are on about.. but i will tell you this for nothing: if i rip a game to ISO with my ps3, and you rip the same disc with your ps3, then the md5 will match and there will be no way to tell the difference between the 2, there will be no digital fingerprint on an ISO, stop talking about stuff you know nothing about..

    Do you know what an MD5 hash is? Do you understand it?

    Do you know what an IRD file is? if you did you would know what you are saying is BS. An IRD file contains a hash of every file in a game, so even if you changed one 1 or 0, it would fail.. so how you going to get a digital fingerprint off one of those files telling which user ripped it?

    This is fundamental computer stuff , thought you were a dev? Did they not teach you about hashes etc? :)

    The only difference might be the timestamp etc, which is easily editable.

    P.S. I think its called digital forensics.. :)
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2019
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    Cypher_CG89

    Cypher_CG89 Senior Member

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    where was that found...... i never put anything like that up
     
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    RandomDude

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    Oh sorry dude, Forgot to mention I edited that pic lol.
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2019
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    Cypher_CG89

    Cypher_CG89 Senior Member

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    This is just stuff I have been reading about, I have no understanding of the techiques involded... or anything like that just the same techniques are used in cyber crime...... did you not read what I put..... THAT I HAVE NO UNDERSTANDING of the the techniques used for this...... but sure just add things that i did not say......

    LOL.... its not quite the way I feel... and if anyone reads the posts propperly then they will see that I just explain what pircay is defined as. People can do as they please for all i care.
     
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    Berion

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    Are You follow by ethics and Your own brain or blindly by some licenses (which BTW means the same as toilet paper in some countries)? There is absolutely nothing wrong in downloading games in ANY form, which You already have from "original distribution"... Who even cares about licenses and permissions? We can agree that piracy is not good to the industry etc. but putting himself the muzzle is simply ridiculous, a philosophy right from tamed societies from various of books...

    Off course I'm against the piracy. However, with all the respect, You wrote some BS... You have no proof that someone who downloaded a game, would buy it. Some peoples pirating because it is easy, easier than making billion accounts, filling by cards etc. and this is not any essential to their life content. If piracy be disappear, their interesting in games would be disappear without any regret. And another story, my personal example: in the 1990-2000 years, when commie scums officially gave back the authority, and law was slowly adjusting to western standards, there are plenty of small shops, stalls etc. with pirate discs. I buying them regularly with no regret. Do You know why? Because originals cost half of the salary. Without piracy I wouldn't ever buying games today (no money for them >> no titles >> no passion and no knowledge)... Third side is simple cultural preservation purpose. Many games are some kind of art and would be great loss for future generation, and to the entire civilisation to not save them for them. Did official ways offering this? Obviously no and if all peoples would be such idiots to follow licenses we already would lost most of them... forever.

    PS: I'm also works in game industry...

    This depend of many aspects. If copy is made properly, then answer is simple: no... ;)

    Fingerprinting is something which never used in games developing. It is possible to make various of implentation of this security layer but for now it is to late for it when games on the disc are the same data from digital store. Still is possible but to costly in resources, time, efforts etc.

    Jezus Christ! Simply, no. No, no, no... To much to explain. ;p
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2019
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    DeViL303

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    I see that.
    What did you not say?

    I'll tell you what you said exactly:
    Wrong, its not at all easy to prove where they came from at all, I'll give you an example, if i downloaded Rebug 4.84 from one server, but you downloaded from another..

    How are you going to tell the difference between the 2 files, as the MD5 will match?


    So where is this digital fingerprint on the Rebug pup hiding?
     
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    pink1

    pink1 Moderator Developer

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    After all of these years you’re finally going to pick on me. I was starting to think you didn’t like me or something jk
    No that’s not at all wat I was trying to say. :p
    I really thought it was okay for anyone to download a rip if they owned the game. This is why I was asking yesterday because I wanna know when I’m wrong.
     
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    DeViL303

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    Great point, @Cypher_CG89 is trying to enforce the law to the letter technically, which is actually different depending where you are, where as ethically, and morally it is perfectly acceptable to download a game you have already bought and we all know it.

    He does not actually know what hes talking about, just trying to sound like does.. same old story.. :)

    At least the experts like you are here to correct him.
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2019
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    Berion

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    Alone checksum is not damage/modify proof as there are counter methods to make collisions (that's the name of such techniques). That's why i.e Linux distros are releasing with various of different checksums or even with signing. This secure the end user from been tricked and of course proofs that files are identical, and also source from they are downloaded doesn't matter as they are identical data. Just my three cents for clarification. ^^
     
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    DeViL303

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    Ah yes, hash collisions are possible with different files, but only reasonably possible on very small very files i think, and only with MASSIVE amounts of CPU power used to generate them, like super computer type shit i think , but worth mentioning alright.
     
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    Death_Dealer

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    You better beleave im not just causing shit, i did a minimal search and found this. Practice what you preach kid. Theres a reason your not a dev here yet. Acting like this isnt gonna get you anything but alot less respect. Attack me all you want, people know who i am.

    upload_2019-3-15_11-37-40.png
     
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    RandomDude

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    You're trying to say he runs 4 channels at the same time am I right?
    Captures.PNG
     
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    Death_Dealer

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    Just to clarify one more thing, i said listen to the devs because 2 devs answered his question. Then a random person posted again saying he could do something he could not and posted a link to something fake. You took alot of what i said waaay out of context.
     
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