PS3 Fan Control Plugin Recommendation?

Discussion in 'General PS3 Discussion' started by xxxmarioxxx, Apr 15, 2019 at 11:52 PM.

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    xxxmarioxxx

    xxxmarioxxx Forum Noob

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    Greetings. I have a jailbroken launch model PS3 CECHA01 and I'm using Webman Mod as my fan controller on it. Everything seems to be working except a little problem.

    When I power on my PS3 and start a game, the fan stays at minimum value, which is 25%, till the temperature reaches about 60C. Then, the fan speeds up to keep the temp under max value I set, which is 63C. However, the problem is that the fan ramps up a little bit slow and it will always reach around 80% and the max temperature will hit up to 70C. I don't think this is related to the thermal paste/dust on heatsink, as after it warms up the temperature could be kept under 63C with fan speed under 50%. I believe there might be a PI controller for controlling the fan speed, is there any way to tweak its parameters?

    I've already done the CPU/GPU delid, replaced thermal paste with Arctic Silver 5, replaced ZSSR5391A PSU with APS227, replaced original 15 blade fan with a 19 baled fan, replaced all thermal pads with new ones, i.e. everything I can do to keep it run as cool as possible to prevent YLOD. Just getting a little paranoid about the whole YLOD things on OG 60GB PS3.
     
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    Naked_Snake1995

    Naked_Snake1995 Member

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    You can always change the Webman parameters to manual mode in the PS3 mode and PS2 Mode, in the settings menu, change the mode to Dynamic Fan to Manual Mode.

    About the YLOD, the problem with YLOD its that its missunderstood by the comunity, but ill try to explain this in plain English and as simple as possible.

    First of all, ever since the YLOD became mainstream, people relate YLOD to be a problem with the solder-balls, that the lead-free solder, causes a disjoint with the Chip and the Motherboard, which its a myth that turns out completely false, the balls dont get disjointed off the chip until 217ºC, a temperature that your PS3 will never reach in years, and reflowing wont help you,neither does reballing. There are cases when the machine needs reballing,but only if the solder-joints are corroded,and for that you need to be 99% sure.

    Even by deliding the GPU and the CPU,and replacing the PSU, you are not safe from YLOD, another thing that the OGs PS3 use that the newer PS3s after the 2000 Series Slim,use are the CPU and GPU Capacitors called NEC/TOKINS, which are responsible for the GPU/CPU power filtering and delivery, and they are notorious to fail with use and age, which can be replaced with Tantalum Capaciotors with a 470uF, 4 Tantalums for each NEC/TOKIN.

    GPU Failure can also lead to YLOD, when the RSX Core its so damaged, that the underfill of the RSX Core doesnt connect with the chip itself, but if that happend,which can, you need to have artifacts on the screen, or freezes.

    NAND Corruption or HDD Failure can also be the culprit.

    To finalize, what i agree the most its that the NEC/TOKIN Capacitors are the culprit of all YLODs, i am still doing a bit of a test, to buy a faulty PS3 with YLOD and replace them with Tantalum Capcitors, i had success with my 60Gb, which had faulty RSX Capacitors,so it would shutdown after a startup,but keeping the console clean also increases the longevity.
     
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    xxxmarioxxx

    xxxmarioxxx Forum Noob

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    Thanks for the reply.

    Yes, I'm well aware and agree that most YLOD are caused by damaged bumps under the GPU die, rather than the soldering balls under the substrate. There's a very good youtube video explaining why reballing flip chip GPU is bulls*it.

    However, I don't agree that bad capacitors are the main cause of YLOD. First of all, many YLOD consoles are temporarily fixed by a reflow, but you can't fix a damaged capacitor by heating it up, right? Also, I saw some video of consoles with dead capacitors, they all power up just fine, and the problem will only show up when the console is under heavy load. For example, sudden shut down when playing the last of us. I will definitely start by replacing the capacitors, if my console starts shutting down during gameplay.

    By the way, do you have a picture of the actual capacitor replacement? I searched online but could only find some pictures for fixing laptops.
     
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    Naked_Snake1995

    Naked_Snake1995 Member

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    You don't believe YLOD its caused by bad capacitors, ok?

    Then let me add this, the NEC TOKIN Capacitors are responsible for the power delivery of both CELL and RSX.

    My CECHC04 would have YLOD to a point that the machine wouldn't start anymore, so i replaced the RSX Capacitors with brand new 470uf 2.5v Ceramic Tantalum Capacitors, and what did it happend? The PS3 was brought back to life, just as i expected.

    All device that use NEC TOKIN capacitors are prone to malfunction failure due to use, heat and capacitor age, i learned this years ago when i owned a Toshiba laptop, that used a similar fashion NEC TOKIN capacitor.

    And yes, these capacitors, can be (fixed) by using heat, the problem is that they are so weakened, that the problem will come back.

    Ill post a board schematic on how to solder them properly and which capacitance needs to be used, 470uf 2.5v at 1200uf combined for the Phats and 330uf 2.5v at 1000uf combined for the Slims.

    Sent from my G8341 using Tapatalk
     
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    xxxmarioxxx

    xxxmarioxxx Forum Noob

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    That's interesting, thanks for the info.

    I have a Green light of death CECHA motherboard lying around right now, and I'll try to replace the capacitor and see if it works.

    It seems that there are three connectors on the capacitor, the center two are ground, one on one side is Vin and the other is Vout. Vin and Vout is connected through an internal inductor. I looked up the datasheet of NEC capacitor, but it didn't mention anything about the inductance. Do you just connect Vin and Vout directly and attach replacement tantalum capacitors to ground?
     
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    Naked_Snake1995

    Naked_Snake1995 Member

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    About the GLOD might be related to a dead GPU or a dead North Bridge, IC Encoder chip might be the culprit as well.
     
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    sandungas

    sandungas Moderator Developer

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    We had a long thread talking about that infamous tokins
    https://www.psx-place.com/threads/c...one-game-ylod-style.20826/page-11#post-157707
    Im giving a direct link to one of my posts because when i posted it i mentioned "the tokin mafia" on purpose to allow me to find it easilly by using the forum search engine :D

    Dont take my drawings in that thread literally though, i never did this repair, is just i like electronics a bit and this story with the tokins called my atention and i was reviewing what they was talking about
    If you want to find a lot more info about this kind of repairs with the tokins you should take a look at a thread in a brazilian forum someone posted
    They had a thread dedicated to the tokins with lot of photos made by several different people, so you are going to see many different ways to do this repair (but be advised, some of them looks like bad ideas, this is why i made some drawings trying to improve what i saw in the brazilian forum)
     
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    Naked_Snake1995

    Naked_Snake1995 Member

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    I actually have a way that i soldered by removing the NEC completely and replacing with Tantalums in its place, the weird thing is, the the NEC has an internal jumper which connects from Positive to Negative and Negative to Positive,but when i soldered tantalums, no jumper was necessary on the both positive side of the tantalums, idk why but it works, maybe there is a hidden trace that allows the current to be filtered,but keep in mind i didnt remove all the NECs, only 1 on the RSX and replace them with 4 470uf 2.5v, while the other 7 NECs still remain on the board,but the PS3 works fine now like it should, i suspect that not all NECs needs to be replaced,maybe only on the RSX side of things, since the CELL itself its a very efficient processor,even at the 90nm fabrication process :)
     
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    sandungas

    sandungas Moderator Developer

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    Well, i think the tokins for the RSX are more prone to failure than the tokins of the CELL

    Inside a game the RSX workload varies a lot, all depends of what you have on screen, so RSX is constantly having workload peaks (that generates temperature peaks, and voltage peaks too)

    The tokins for the RSX have to deal with that... is like a capricious kid changing his mind all the time
    "give me more" --> "hey stop not so much" ---> now i need moar" --> "stop" ---> "i want it! nao" ---> "that was enought"
    All that changes forces the capacitors to charge and discharge a bit but constantly
     
    Last edited: Apr 20, 2019 at 7:20 AM
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    arcadekidflo

    arcadekidflo Member

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    Try the fan control from Irisman , i think it has more precise timings
     
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    Naked_Snake1995

    Naked_Snake1995 Member

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    I agree, i am still trying to get another Faulty PS3 just for science and bust this YLOD myth after almost 13 years, with replacing the NEC TOKINS on the RSX front.

    This will be more than a solid proof, that YLOD might be a specific problem, but that depends on the Beep patters and how long it takes to react.

    Sent from my G8341 using Tapatalk
     
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    sandungas

    sandungas Moderator Developer

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    Is like in this drawing
    [​IMG]

    The water tanks (the tokins) have the same size for CELL and RSX
    The hole at bottom of the water tank is the demand from CELL and RSX... lets say CELL and RSX can make that hole bigger or smaller... and as a consequence of it the water level inside the tank varies

    Well... the only difference is the water level inside the RSX tank moves up and down a lot faster
    I guess capacitors are designed to hold a max amount of chanrges and discharges (lets say several millions) and what happens is the tokins of the RSX wears out faster and gets closer to that limit faster
    In other words... the lifespan of the RSX tokins is shorter because they are working more
     
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    Naked_Snake1995

    Naked_Snake1995 Member

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    Thats reasonable, and quite plausible. GPUs always have a higher workload than the CPUs, and thats understandable.

    As long as YLOD its the cause of RSX Faulty Capacitors, which can be replaced, this can bring many machines back to life, and shorten the odds of what YLOD can be! Catch my meaning :)

    Sent from my G8341 using Tapatalk
     
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