PS3 (Research/Experimental) - NEC/TOKIN Capacitors Replacement - YLOD

[ObsessedGeorge]

Hello, I have a phat PS3 CECHK04 with the DIA-002 motherboard and I my YLOD is instant.

I removed the 4 NEC/TOKIN capacitors on the RSX/CELL side of the board.
Before soldering the new tantalums I checked the traces with the multimeter in continuity mode. The positive and negative sides are connected according to the buzzer. This isn't normal, right?
I have replaced the 4 NEC/TOKIN capacitors with sixteen 470uf tantalums but the problem is still the same. Instant YLOD.
Any help would be appreciated.

 

[cfreddykrueger]

Hi
Please can you let me know sometihng
Do you know if it makes a difference to the ylod if using one jumper wire for the CELL and one for the RSX compared to using 2 wires for the CELL and two for the RSX
Will this make a difference for a 2-4 second ylod where the fan turns on for about 2-4 seconds
Please will really appreciate your input and everyone's input in this

Thanks

When I was repairing mine I didn't add any jumpers until I removed all of the Nec/Tokins. I just followed the tutorial provided by @Naked_Snake1995
If you removed all of the Nec/ Tokins then you will need a jumper for each Nec/Tokin on the top side of the board (RSX/CELL side) total of 4 jumpers.

Which Nec/Tokins did you replace? If you can post some pictures of your work that would be helpful.

 

[ps3xbox]

When I was repairing mine I didn't add any jumpers until I removed all of the Nec/Tokins. I just followed the tutorial provided by @Naked_Snake1995
If you removed all of the Nec/ Tokins then you will need a jumper for each Nec/Tokin on the top side of the board (RSX/CELL side) total of 4 jumpers.

Which Nec/Tokins did you replace? If you can post some pictures of your work that would be helpful.

HI
I know I should post photos but My camera is really bad
I replaced all the tokins also
I thought that only two jumper wires are needed and can be placed

In this photo there are four wires (2 for the CELL and 2 the RSX)
Is this only on this side on have you put on the other side as well

The question I asked that would putting less wires cause the 2-3 second delay
If I put the wires in the photo below and only on the side shown, will it help the ylod
please
Thanks again mate

 

[cfreddykrueger]

"In this photo there are four wires (2 for the CELL and 2 the RSX)
Is this only on this side on have you put on the other side as well"

Yes this is the only side that I put jumpers on. The other side is just the tantalums.

"The question I asked that would putting less wires cause the 2-3 second delay
If I put the wires in the photo below and only on the side shown, will it help the ylod"

I'm going to say yes. If you replaced all of the Tokins and you still have YLOD ( 2-3 seconds to me is instant. It's the type of YLOD I was having before I started replacing the Tokins) You need to add two more jumpers if you only have two like you said.
Here's The other side of my board (bottom). No jumpers here just the tantalums

 

[Grey Ghost]

I can't even begin to describe how angry it makes me that you oriented the top 2 on the far right differently than the rest.

I tried stripping off some masking to see if I can make them all sit straight instead of an angle. That immediately failed because there was MAYBE 2-3mm between the caps meaning I couldn't get my iron and solder in there, not even with my smallest/thinnest tip.

I hope you get a paper cut.

Just for that, I hope you get paper cuts on your webbing

 

[cfreddykrueger]

"In this photo there are four wires (2 for the CELL and 2 the RSX)
Is this only on this side on have you put on the other side as well"

Yes this is the only side that I put jumpers on. The other side is just the tantalums.

"The question I asked that would putting less wires cause the 2-3 second delay
If I put the wires in the photo below and only on the side shown, will it help the ylod"

I'm going to say yes. If you replaced all of the Tokins and you still have YLOD ( 2-3 seconds to me is instant. It's the type of YLOD I was having before I started replacing the Tokins) You need to add two more jumpers if you only have two like you said.
Here's The other side of my board (bottom). No jumpers here just the tantalums

View attachment 25685

@ps3xbox

I apologize I'm having issues with the Tapatalk app on my phone. It's not letting my insert photos and I have to log into a web browser and i did not tag you in my last replay to your post.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[ps3xbox]

"In this photo there are four wires (2 for the CELL and 2 the RSX)
Is this only on this side on have you put on the other side as well"

Yes this is the only side that I put jumpers on. The other side is just the tantalums.

"The question I asked that would putting less wires cause the 2-3 second delay
If I put the wires in the photo below and only on the side shown, will it help the ylod"

I'm going to say yes. If you replaced all of the Tokins and you still have YLOD ( 2-3 seconds to me is instant. It's the type of YLOD I was having before I started replacing the Tokins) You need to add two more jumpers if you only have two like you said.
Here's The other side of my board (bottom). No jumpers here just the tantalums

View attachment 25685

Thanks for the photos, I will for sure try this later but could you let me know something please
Does it matter which side the jumper wires go
does it make a difference
Thanks again

 

[cfreddykrueger]

Thanks, im interested in that details since time ago
Im going to use a photo from a PS3 slim to show it, im not sure if what is at right of the photo is RSX, but for CELL is the same, and is the same schematic for all PS3 models

My point is each 2 tokins are soldered in paralell (this is obvious by looking at the photos)... but the VIAS in the V_IN and V_OUT sides are connected with another 2 tokins at the other side of the board

So electrically, the circuit is like this:

@ps3xbox

The tutorial states that the internal jumper is on the top side of the board (RSX/CELL side). I didn't experiment with this on mine I just did as the tutorial said. I can see where you would want to put the jumper wires on the bottom side of the board because there's a little more room to work with.

In theory I would think that the jumpers would work on either side. It seems that the Tokins are mirrored to each other on both sides of the board and the four RSX Tokins and the 4 CELL Tokins and share the same circuit.

Without having a schematic that spells this out I can only tell you what I know based off of my experience.

Mores seasoned vets of this topic may have to help answer this for you mate.

@sandungus explains its way better than I ever could as quoted above.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[ps3xbox]

@ps3xbox

The tutorial states that the internal jumper is on the top side of the board (RSX/CELL side). I didn't experiment with this on mine I just did as the tutorial said. I can see where you would want to put the jumper wires on the bottom side of the board because there's a little more room to work with.

In theory I would think that the jumpers would work on either side. It seems that the Tokins are mirrored to each other on both sides of the board and the four RSX Tokins and the 4 CELL Tokins and share the same circuit.

Without having a schematic that spells this out I can only tell you what I know based off of my experience.

Mores seasoned vets of this topic may have to help answer this for you mate.

@sandungus explains its way better than I ever could as quoted above.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Hi
Thanks for all this information
I saw this
I will try the jumper wire like you did and lets see

Thanks again

 

[marciolsf]

Hey fellas,

so here's the block diagram for the section that includes the tokins. This is for the bottom side of the board, but the top side is identical.

It's a little hard to read, but it basically says that the RSX has 4 tokins connected to it (2 on each side of the board), and the positive side of the NECs have all to be connected to each other. The CELL tokins are not directly related to the RSX ones. When you remove all four of the NECs, that positive connection disappears, hence the need for the bridge wire. You NEED to have those positive poles connected together.

See the image below. It only shows the two tokins on the top side of the board for the RSX, but via's on the board connect them to the tokins on the bottom side as well.

I did a bit of testing yesterday, and here's what I determined: With the RSX jumper wire installed, ALL the positive sides for the RSX tokins are connected. This means that you should have continuity from the TOP A +, all the way down to the BOTTOM B +. This one wire also enables connectivity with RSX tokins on the bottom half of the board. If you're replacing all 4 tokins on the Cell side, you'll still need a jumper wire on that side, but just one!

Even without the wire, A and B are always connected on the BOTTOM +, and A and B are always connected on the TOP + (negatives are always connected no matter what). But the jumper wire connects TOP + and BOTTOM + together, completing the circuit.

What I can also determine is that you don't need TWO wires per 4-tokin set (I've even seen people add 4 wires per set -- two on the bottom half of the board and two on the top half).

Finally, without the jumper wires, the board will power up, but you will get the fastest YLOD of your life, probably < .5 seconds. This is not a short circuit, it's just a lack of continuity.

EDIT: not sure why my images are not showing up in line. If someone can help clarify what I did wrong, I'd appreciate it! In the meantime, the images are also attached.

EDIT 2: thanks @sandungas! images are linked correctly now.

 

[ps3xbox]

Hey fellas,

so here's the block diagram for the section that includes the tokins. This is for the bottom side of the board, but the top side is identical.

https://imgur.com/AlICNjJ

It's a little hard to read, but it basically says that the RSX has 4 tokins connected to it (2 on each side of the board), and the positive side of the NECs have all to be connected to each other. The CELL tokins are not directly related to the RSX ones. When you remove all four of the NECs, that positive connection disappears, hence the need for the bridge wire. You NEED to have those positive poles connected together.

See the image below. It only shows the two tokins on the top side of the board for the RSX, but via's on the board connect them to the tokins on the bottom side as well.

https://imgur.com/AlICNjJ

I did a bit of testing yesterday, and here's what I determined: With the RSX jumper wire installed, ALL the positive sides for the RSX tokins are connected. This means that you should have continuity from the TOP A +, all the way down to the BOTTOM B +. This one wire also enables connectivity with RSX tokins on the bottom half of the board. If you're replacing all 4 tokins on the Cell side, you'll still need a jumper wire on that side, but just one!

Even without the wire, A and B are always connected on the BOTTOM +, and A and B are always connected on the TOP + (negatives are always connected no matter what). But the jumper wire connects TOP + and BOTTOM + together, completing the circuit.

What I can also determine is that you don't need TWO wires per 4-tokin set (I've even seen people add 4 wires per set -- two on the bottom half of the board and two on the top half).

Finally, without the jumper wires, the board will power up, but you will get the fastest YLOD of your life, probably < .5 seconds. This is not a short circuit, it's just a lack of continuity.

EDIT: not sure why my images are not showing up in line. If someone can help clarify what I did wrong, I'd appreciate it! In the meantime, the images are also attached.

Hi
So does it matter which side the jumper wire goes ?

 

[marciolsf]

Hi
So does it matter which side the jumper wire goes ?

As far as which half of the board, I wouldn't think so, but i didn't test that specifically (I had just resoldered them on the top half, and didn't feel like pulling them out again ).

As far as in relation to the tokins/tantalumns, no, it doesn't matter. You do have to keep in mind clearance, though, and ease of installation. It seems to me that top side and to the outside of the install area (as suggested in the original post) is easier since there's more clearance from the heatshield and from other components.

EDIT: spelling

 

[ps3xbox]

As far as which half of the board, I wouldn't think so, but i didn't test that specifically (I had just resoldered them on the top half, and didn't feel like pulling them out again ).

As far as in relation to the tokins/tantalumns, no, it doesn't matter. You do have to keep in mind clearance, though, and ease of installation. It seems to me that top side and to the outside of the install area (as suggested in the original post) is easier since there's more clearance from the heatshield and from other components.

EDIT: spelling

Did you solder the jumper wire on the side where the cell and rsx is
please let me know
thanks again

 

[Workz_777]

Hello, I have a phat PS3 CECHK04 with the DIA-002 motherboard and I my YLOD is instant.

I removed the 4 NEC/TOKIN capacitors on the RSX/CELL side of the board.
Before soldering the new tantalums I checked the traces with the multimeter in continuity mode. The positive and negative sides are connected according to the buzzer. This isn't normal, right?
I have replaced the 4 NEC/TOKIN capacitors with sixteen 470uf tantalums but the problem is still the same. Instant YLOD.
Any help would be appreciated.

Hiya George, bro could you let us know where you were probing? When you say "traces" do you mean the large contact strips the NEC/Tokins were soldered to? Or were you probing the Vias?

 

[marciolsf]

Did you solder the jumper wire on the side where the cell and rsx is
please let me know
thanks again

I soldered them on the side where the cell and rsx chips are, yes. That's usually what we mean by "top side of the board".

 

[sandungas]

@marciolsf when uploading an image to imgur you need to click in it when is 100% uploaded (to display it for you zoomed in), and copy the link from the zoomed image... you will know you copyed it correct because it ends with the file extension (.png or whatever), this means is a direct link to the .png file. Then post it in the forum this way:
[img]https://i.imgur.com/AlICNjJ.png[/img]
[img]https://i.imgur.com/AAI6waL.png[/img]

Spoiler

are not displayed correctly in this post im writing because im using a trick to disable them, this allows me to show you how is made

And yeah, is like in the drawings i made months ago, the original circuit is like this:

Thanks, im interested in that details since time ago
Im going to use a photo from a PS3 slim to show it, im not sure if what is at right of the photo is RSX, but for CELL is the same, and is the same schematic for all PS3 models

My point is each 2 tokins are soldered in paralell (this is obvious by looking at the photos)... but the VIAS in the V_IN and V_OUT sides are connected with another 2 tokins at the other side of the board

So electrically, the circuit is like this:

When we replace the tokins by tantalums is like this:

...and by replacing the tokins with tantalum capacitors what you are doing is this circuit

As you can see, incase of replacing all the tokins is needed to use 1 wire to connect V_IN with V_OUT
This is the wire i was discussing before... there is people that uses lot of wires for it, but only is needed 1 (use a thick wire btw)

But what we are really doing is this, compare the image above with the image below... electrically are exactly the same:

Lol, we are doing this basically, no magic inside

 

[marciolsf]

Thanks! And thanks for clarifying the input/output direction too, I wanted to figure that out but the service manual is soooo long...

 

[sandungas]

Thanks! And thanks for clarifying the input/output direction too, I wanted to figure that out but the service manual is soooo long...

In the drawings i made i was considering CELL/RSX are at the right (so i was drawing the output always at right), but i guess in the image of the service manual you posted the output is at the left btw

Anyway, if we simplify it we can say CELL is powered by 2 wires (and RSX by another 2 wires)
And in bwteen that 2 wires there is a bunch of tokins, but are working as a single component (4 tokins of 1200uf together = a single tokin of 4800uf)
Is just NEC/TOKIN was not manufacturing them in that huge amount of capacitance... but incase it existed we could reduce the circuit to only 1 tokin for CELL and only 1 tokin for RSX

 

[sandungas]

but i guess in the image of the service manual you posted the output is at the left btw

Im taking another look at it and i dont think
I said that because in the image there are a lot of capacitors at the right and i was not sure what is his purpose... but now im thinking that maybe are all the tiny SMD decoupling capacitors located at the bottom side of CELL/RSX

 

[ps3xbox]

Hi
All
Please can anyone explain something
So on the 12v line where the prongs are
If i put my multimeter probes across the two prongs and set meter to continuity beep more the meter beeps for a second and stops. If i change the probes round no beeps but if change them around again same thing .
I've tried different multimeter and get the same
Please can anyone explain what's causing this
Many Thanks